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iCM Forum Film World Cup match 4B: Japan vs Poland; Voting deadline: October 25
Topic Started: Oct 11 2015, 12:04:53 PM (3,179 Views)
mjf314
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This is match 4B of the iCM Forum Film World Cup.

JAPANvPOLAND
Onna no naka ni iru tanin / The Stranger Within a Woman (1966)vPrzesluchanie / Interrogation (1989)
MelveletvCarmel98

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Voting Rules:
- You must watch both films before you vote.
- To vote, rank the 2 films from most favorite to least favorite. (note: you're ranking the individual films, not the countries)

The film with more #1 votes wins. If there's a tie, the match will be extended 3 days.

Here's a quick summary of how the tournament works
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mightysparks
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1. Onna no naka ni iru tanin
2. Przesluchanie
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Cocoa
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1. Przesluchanie
2. Onna no naka ni iru tanin
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brokenface
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1. Interrogation
2. The Stranger Within a Woman

The Naruse is pretty good though not quite up there with his earlier stuff for me. Interrogation is a film I really rate & would've beaten any of the other picks in this round.
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zuma
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01. Onna no naka ni iru tanin

02. Przesluchanie

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Mario Gaborović
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1. Przesluchanie
2. Onna no naka ni iru tanin

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Melvelet
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la recherche du temps perdu...
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Write-up for Onna no naka ni iru tanin / The Stranger Within a Woman
https://cinematalk.wordpress.com/2015/07/09/onna-no-naka-ni-iru-tanin-the-stranger-within-a-woman-1966/
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klaus78
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1. Onna no naka ni iru tanin (Japan)
2. Przesluchanie (Poland)
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XxXApathy420XxX
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1. 女の中にいる他人 [The Stranger Within a Woman] (1966) 6/10
2. Przesłuchanie [Interrogation] (1989) 6/10

No threats this time cause I barely care for either film, and the last threat did so well. Looks like I gotta live up to it when the previous match ends.
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Jay Mars
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1. Przesluchanie
2. Onna no naka ni iru tanin
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insomnius
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1. Przesluchanie / Interrogation (1989)
2. Onna no naka ni iru tanin / The Stranger Within a Woman (1966)

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jvv
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Onna no naka ni iru tanin - It might just be me, but I felt the reactions to the murder were rather subdued.
Przesluchanie - I can see why this movie was banned.

1. Przesluchanie - 7/10
2. Onna no naka ni iru tanin - 6/10
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joachimt
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Very close call...

1. Onna no naka ni iru tanin
2. Przesluchanie
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Mario Gaborović
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Posted ImageOnna no naka ni iru tanin 5-6 PrzesłuchaniePosted Image
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Gershwin
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1. Przesłuchanie (8.5/10)
2. Onna no naka ni iru tanin (7/10)
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monty
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1. Onna no naka ni iru tanin
2. Przesluchanie
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Melvelet
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la recherche du temps perdu...
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1. Onna no naka ni iru tanin 9+/10
2. Przesluchanie 8/10
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Rad82
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Only seen Interrogation.

Pretty decent around an 7-7,5 for me, solid female protagonist & setting, but something left to be desired in terms of scenario, it misses the extra edge to make it a great movie.

Haven't seen the Naruse Film though.
Edited by Rad82, Oct 15 2015, 12:01:31 PM.
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joachimt
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Wrong thread...
Edited by joachimt, Oct 14 2015, 04:49:03 PM.
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Armoreska
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Przesluchanie 8.5(9)/10
Onna 8/10

Japan'll have to manage without my vote

Great round, all 8 to 9 movies
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Melvelet
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la recherche du temps perdu...
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Posted ImageOnna no naka ni iru tanin 7-8 PrzesłuchaniePosted Image

Another close match!
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mightysparks
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I didn't think Przesłuchanie would have a chance at all :ermm: Such a terrible film, I'm surprised so many people like it.
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Lonewolf2003
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1. Onna no naka ni iru tanin (1966): 7.5 - It was already decent and just winning this round (I watched this last), but the ending made the victory certain.
2. Przesluchanie (1989): 6.8 - Yes this kind of authoritative regime is of course terrible and being interrogated by the police like this is horrendous. So the movie has a important message to make. But that message was clear after awhile and I caught myself looking too many times at the clock to consider it good. The Kafkaesqueness of never knowing why she is picked up in the first place at all was a another plus side of the movie.
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metaller
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I had first watched the Japanese entry and thought it would be hard for the Polish entry to beat it, but it did.
Despite the same rating here, the one entry is closer to an 8 and the other closer to a 7.
Solid round. :)

1. Przesluchanie 7.5/10
2. Onna no naka ni iru tanin 7.5/10

Quick thoughts:

Przesluchanie / Interrogation (1989, Ryszard Bugajski)
A woman gets thrown into prison and continuously interrogated but doesn't know why she even is there in the first place. This Kafka-esque situation often makes for a good film and this script and the performances sell the premise really well. Conveyes a feeling of unease and tension throughout.
7.5/10

Onna no naka ni iru tanin / The Stranger Within a Woman (1966, Mikio Naruse)
A guy commits a crime and has trouble dealing with the the guilt. Good personal drama that always stays involving.
7.5/10
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Angel Glez
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1. The Stranger Within a Woman
2. Interrogation

I propose an alternative (French) double bill: Juste avant la nuit (1971) vs L'aveu (1970). ;)

There are 11 Naruses in my Japanese top 100:
Tsuma yo bara no y ni [Wife! Be Like a Rose!] (1935)
Kafuku zempen & Kafuku khen [Learn from Experience] (1937)
Magokoro [Sincerity] (1939)
Haru no mezame [Spring Awakens] (1947)
Inazuma [Lightning] (1952)
Okaasan [Mother] (1952)
Yama no oto [Sound of the Mountain] (1954)
Iwashigumo [Summer Clouds] (1958)
Onna no za [A Woman's Place] (1962)
Midareru [Yearning] (1964)
Midaregumo [Scattered Clouds] (1967)
"Stranger" is bit lower in my estimation (I slightly prefer Chabrol's remake), but I love Naruse.
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perceval
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1. The Stranger Within a Woman 6/10 or 7/10
2. Interrogation 3/10
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bobbybrown
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perceval
Oct 17 2015, 09:31:55 AM
2. Interrogation 3/10
I'm morbidly curios what could have caused such a harsh rating.
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perceval
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bobbybrown
Oct 17 2015, 01:29:58 PM
perceval
Oct 17 2015, 09:31:55 AM
2. Interrogation 3/10
I'm morbidly curios what could have caused such a harsh rating.
A while since I saw it. I liked the theme but I probably had issues with it being too obvious or something.
Edited by perceval, Oct 17 2015, 02:49:14 PM.
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Mario Gaborović
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bobbybrown
Oct 17 2015, 01:29:58 PM
perceval
Oct 17 2015, 09:31:55 AM
2. Interrogation 3/10
I'm morbidly curios what could have caused such a harsh rating.
I noticed Filip doesn't like politics in art. I'll take it as a preference since I don't like war genre, for instance (all those Polish + Russian trauma war films do not mean much to me)
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perceval
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Mario Gaborović
Oct 17 2015, 02:45:50 PM
bobbybrown
Oct 17 2015, 01:29:58 PM
perceval
Oct 17 2015, 09:31:55 AM
2. Interrogation 3/10
I'm morbidly curios what could have caused such a harsh rating.
I noticed Filip doesn't like politics in art. I'll take it as a preference since I don't like war genre, for instance (all those Polish + Russian trauma war films do not mean much to me)
I have nothing against it, but it's also true(-ish). I'm more interested in how films could express political views than the ideologies alone.
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sortile9io
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World Champion!
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perceval
Oct 17 2015, 02:44:58 PM
bobbybrown
Oct 17 2015, 01:29:58 PM
perceval
Oct 17 2015, 09:31:55 AM
2. Interrogation 3/10
I'm morbidly curios what could have caused such a harsh rating.
A while since I saw it. I liked the theme but I probably had issues with it being too obvious or something.
I wonder too if your 2/10 for Blancanieves on the other semifinal was also due to a particular issue, perhaps with bullfighting?
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joachimt
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perceval
Oct 17 2015, 02:44:58 PM
bobbybrown
Oct 17 2015, 01:29:58 PM
perceval
Oct 17 2015, 09:31:55 AM
2. Interrogation 3/10
I'm morbidly curios what could have caused such a harsh rating.
A while since I saw it. I liked the theme but I probably had issues with it being too obvious or something.
The performance of the lead actress is enough to at least see some good in this movie, right? :shrug:
Maybe your 3/10 means something different than mine. "Having some issues" is not enough for me to rate it so low.
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mightysparks
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I gave it a 4/10 when I saw it. I thought it was cheap and tacky, poorly made and I thought the acting was bad as well. It wasn't painful, it was just not good.
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perceval
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I had big problems watching Blancanieves. Hysterical I would say, as if was trying to make me Buy anything (silent movies perhaps).

Interrogation is more the "not my kind of film" case, but I also agree with mighty. The acting was ok, as I recall it, though.
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Mario Gaborović
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I thought the best thing about Przesluchanie was Krystyna Janda's performance. Everything else was much seen anti-authoritarian material, but even that was something compared to rather flat & unexciting Naruse.
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mightysparks
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To be fair, I don't remember it very well so the acting might've been ok. But I remember thinking it seemed very amateurish.
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monclivie
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Mario Gaborović
Oct 17 2015, 03:46:27 PM
I thought the best thing about Przesluchanie was Krystyna Janda's performance. Everything else was much seen anti-authoritarian material, but even that was something compared to rather flat & unexciting Naruse.
She is known for her shaky-hands stagey acting. This is her only role I could say I like.
Edited by monclivie, Oct 17 2015, 06:18:57 PM.
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bobbybrown
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I guess I'm again on a bit of a tangent, but I can never understand complaints about bad acting in films. I can barely remember any times when I felt that an actor's performance really ruined my impression of a movie. A great role - sure, I remember those, and it's always impressive and even cathartic to witness when an actor goes to great lengths to give its character a unique personality, or portrays a complex and compelling array of emotions caused by subtle - or even extreme - experiences that their character goes through. Falconetti instantly comes to mind, and btw Janda's role in Przesluchanie is in some ways similar to her, even though the ways they cope with their suffering don't have much in common.

But bad acting? How can one even notice it, or even more, let it ruin their experience? Speaking of Janda, her meth-junkie role in Man of Marble was perplexing, eccentric and maybe barely fitting the sorrowful tone of the main story, that of falling victim to a myth that created you, but so what? It's part of the film's overall style, it gives it its unique flavor, and besides - who am I to judge another human being for how they - in a literal sense - act?

I guess what bothers me the most is what feels to me like a certain arrogance, a belief that a viewer somehow knows everything there is to know about how humans with various backgrounds and personalities behave in all kinds of situations, and even more, how they should and should not behave. This reaction wasn't realistic, nobody does that, look how stupid this guy is, ad nauseam. I wish I had that level of expertise.

(I think I just wrote another rant. If you are calling from a touch-tone phone please press 1. Press 2 if you wish I would fuck off already with this condescending bullshit. If you are calling because you want service on an existing order, press 3.)
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mightysparks
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I get some of your points, but when I say 'bad acting' I generally mean that it's bad in that it took me out of the film, it felt out of place in that film's world etc. I mean, if you can't say 'bad acting', then you can't say bad script or bad cinematography or bad music either. Even if any of those things isn't particularly bad in itself, if it feels out of place in the film or it's jarring then it can also be bad. 'Bad acting' isn't necessarily a comment that the character isn't behaving realistically, but that their acting didn't work for you. Stylized acting can work well if the rest of the film's style/script/world fits it in a way that it all works together. If you don't find a character believable that could be due to the script, the editing, the acting or a combination of those factors or other factors. There's nothing arrogant about not finding the way a character behaves believable because the film is trying to convince you that it is. But that's still something completely different to a comment about the acting.
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Mario Gaborović
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But if you say "the acting is terrible", don't you think it's just your oppinion and maybe NOT the reasonable quality of the acting? Also, do you ever consider different culture/different cinema ? (which means Anglophonic world is not a definite yardstick that films from other world look upon to, nor they should)
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