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iCM Forum's Favourite Experimental/Avant-Garde Films (NOMINATIONS); Deadline April 24th
Topic Started: Apr 4 2016, 06:02:50 AM (2,501 Views)
joachimt
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iCM Forum's Favourite Experimental/Avant-Garde Films

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Since nobody else seemed interested in starting this poll, I'll do it.

Submit your list of favorite experimental/avant-garde films.
Rules:
- IMDb- or iCM-lists allowed. If you can't make a list yourself, post a list of IMDb-urls in this thread.
- Only fully ranked or unranked lists allowed.
- Films, documentaries, mini-series, shorts allowed.
- Since this genre is very hard to determine where it begins and ends, I won't debate about whether something is experimental or not. If you think it is, you can include it. If enough people think it is, consensus has decided.

Deadline: April 24th

Countdown till deadline

Lists:
https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/stephen+dwoskins+film+is...+the+international+free+cinema/lampadatriste/
https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/amos+vogels+film+as+a+subversive+art/
https://rateyourmusic.com/films/chart?page=1&chart_type=top&type=film&year=alltime&genre_include=1&include_child_genres=1&genres=experimental&include_child_genres_chk=1&include=both&limit=none&countries=

Participants:
allisoncm
bal3x
beavis (unranked)
Caracortada
Carmel98
connordenney
Dolwphin (iCM-list)
Ettinauer226XL
frbrown
funkybusiness
Gershwin (unranked) (iCM-list)
insomnius (unranked)
jvv (unranked)
Lilarcor
Lonewolf2003
mathiasa (iCM-list)
Melvelet (unranked)
mjf314
MNA
Perception de Ambiguity
perceval
themagician (unranked)
TraverseTown
zuma (iCM-list)

All votes so far in random order (updated April 10th)
Edited by joachimt, Apr 25 2016, 11:47:22 AM.
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Rich
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This is opening up a big can of worms since avant-garde is a rather broad term.
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PeacefulAnarchy
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Rich
Apr 4 2016, 06:08:15 AM
This is opening up a big can of worms since avant-garde is a rather broad term.
Yeah, this. Does Eternal Sunshine count? The Holy Mountain? Belle de jour? Blue Velvet? F for Fake? Cabinet of Dr. Caligari?
These are not conventional films, but they're not Brakhage or Benning either.
Edited by PeacefulAnarchy, Apr 4 2016, 06:30:40 AM.
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beavis
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https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/stephen+dwoskins+film+is...+the+international+free+cinema/lampadatriste/
https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/amos+vogels+film+as+a+subversive+art/

these lists will help, but you can make it more restrictive by naming some art-movements the film or filmmaker needs to belong to and excluding anything with too much narrative. The examples PA names are all too narrative, and only Caligari is with the expressionism avant-garde in form... I agree that it is a bit boring to discuss all this, but I would like the list to represent art/theory and not movies that are on the slippery slope of 'a bit weird' (all genre films would aply for instance)
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Gershwin
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Two fine lists indeed, but besides, I wouldn't know where to start such a list ...
I guess I'll just go through my favourites and see which films are experimental.
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perceval
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http://www.imdb.com/list/ls034836946
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funkybusiness
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Charlemagne Palestine made movies? dang.
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XxXApathy420XxX
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For now I just went through RYM's experimental genre tag, although I won't count The Autobiography of Nicolae Ceausescu, Gummo, Shadows, Stronger Than Paradise and On the Bowery as experimental. I'll go through my ratings later this week to see what else can be included and finish my list.

Here's the RYM charts for experimental films: https://rateyourmusic.com/films/chart?page=1&chart_type=top&type=film&year=alltime&genre_include=1&include_child_genres=1&genres=experimental&include_child_genres_chk=1&include=both&limit=none&countries=

http://www.imdb.com/list/ls034863158/
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beavis
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Ok, spent the morning looking through my favorites, and it is indeed hard to decide at some point what to include and what not... so I won't even begin to rank the titles I came up with

In the spoilertags below is my unranked, alphabetical list of favorites that would belong in a poll like this according to me

Spoiler: click to toggle
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tommy_leazaq
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Just let the participants decide what constitutes an Avant-Garde films. Then the results thread would be too much fun. Just like Horror/Comedy results thread. :D
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Gershwin
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L'eclisse, Werckmeister Harmonies and Le bonheur are all three in my top 50 favourite films, but I don't think I'll include them in my list. They feel too narrative to me.
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Torgo
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I suspect a lot of David Lynch in the top ranks, because he's the most popular of the "rather experimental" lot (which will hurt the ranks of Brakhage, Frampton, Snow etc.)


I suggest we only take the lists of perceval and Dolphwin and assemble a Top 100 by that. Then there should be no discussions about whether it's avant-garde enough. :whistling:
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3rd
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Torgo
Apr 4 2016, 11:33:40 AM



I suggest we only take the lists of perceval and Dolphwin and assemble a Top 100 by that. Then there should be no discussions about whether it's avant-garde enough. :whistling:
You mean the list (not lists) and don't forget the other random Swedish art-house kids here Wille and karldaniel.
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Gershwin
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I honestly find it very hard to say when a film is experimental/avant-garde and when it isn't. :shrug:

Anyhow, here's my list, unranked. If anybody thinks "hey, that's not an experimental film", please let me know.
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insomnius
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perceval
Apr 4 2016, 07:34:25 AM
I think you've got the wrong "Misery Loves Company" in there.

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jvv
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tommy_leazaq
Apr 4 2016, 10:35:32 AM
Just let the participants decide what constitutes an Avant-Garde films. Then the results thread would be too much fun. Just like Horror/Comedy results thread. :D
+1

It's always interesting to see what people consider belongs to a certain genre or not. Besides the most questionable inclusions will be filtered out because of consensus anyway.
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jvv
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Gershwin
Apr 4 2016, 11:18:21 AM
L'eclisse, Werckmeister Harmonies and Le bonheur are all three in my top 50 favourite films, but I don't think I'll include them in my list. They feel too narrative to me.
experimental does not equal non-narrative (although most are)
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Gershwin
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jvv
Apr 4 2016, 01:05:37 PM
Gershwin
Apr 4 2016, 11:18:21 AM
L'eclisse, Werckmeister Harmonies and Le bonheur are all three in my top 50 favourite films, but I don't think I'll include them in my list. They feel too narrative to me.
experimental does not equal non-narrative (although most are)
You might be very well right, but then what would be an example of a narrative experimental film?
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Rich
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Gershwin
Apr 4 2016, 01:08:19 PM
jvv
Apr 4 2016, 01:05:37 PM
Gershwin
Apr 4 2016, 11:18:21 AM
L'eclisse, Werckmeister Harmonies and Le bonheur are all three in my top 50 favourite films, but I don't think I'll include them in my list. They feel too narrative to me.
experimental does not equal non-narrative (although most are)
You might be very well right, but then what would be an example of a narrative experimental film?
90% of Lynch.
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allisoncm
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http://www.imdb.com/list/ls034844796/

I'll probably add more later. I'm doing some soul-searching: whether or not to include more narrative films.
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Gershwin
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Rich
Apr 4 2016, 01:10:37 PM
Gershwin
Apr 4 2016, 01:08:19 PM
jvv
Apr 4 2016, 01:05:37 PM
Gershwin
Apr 4 2016, 11:18:21 AM
L'eclisse, Werckmeister Harmonies and Le bonheur are all three in my top 50 favourite films, but I don't think I'll include them in my list. They feel too narrative to me.
experimental does not equal non-narrative (although most are)
You might be very well right, but then what would be an example of a narrative experimental film?
90% of Lynch.
I should add Eraserhead.
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jvv
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My list:

http://www.imdb.com/list/ls034868613 UNRANKED

I might have been a little too inclusive, but since my list is unranked the movies on it won't get many points anyway.
Edited by jvv, Apr 4 2016, 02:54:53 PM.
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bal3x
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Ettinauer226XL
Apr 4 2016, 08:44:33 AM
Is this list on IMDb and if not how do we get it up there? I cannot see how I can make a list without this.
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Kasparius
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Rich
Apr 4 2016, 06:08:15 AM
This is opening up a big can of worms since avant-garde is a rather broad term.
Avant-garde a clue.
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Carmel1379
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Experimental, avant-garde, "film as film" (a nice vague phrase perceval wrote down) works, and what I feel are original films without some thorough structure/script, i.e. in the process of filmmaking there is a myriad possibilities one cannot all clearly consciously analyze, so that the film "discovers" and creates itself. Ranked. http://www.imdb.com/list/ls034897080/

I'll add more stuff later and I might adjust this list to other lists - see what is or is not considered experimental by others and change accordingly...
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Lilarcor
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I don't know what I'm doing.
http://www.imdb.com/list/ls034081736/ (ranked)
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mathiasa
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ranked: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDhAVAlYTIQ
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Torgo
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mathiasa
Apr 4 2016, 04:32:11 PM
This list is clearly not experimental enough. Disqualified.
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mathiasa
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Torgo
Apr 4 2016, 04:49:49 PM
mathiasa
Apr 4 2016, 04:32:11 PM
This list is clearly not experimental enough. Disqualified.
:mw_confused:
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joachimt
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beavis
Apr 4 2016, 09:52:04 AM
Ok, spent the morning looking through my favorites, and it is indeed hard to decide at some point what to include and what not... so I won't even begin to rank the titles I came up with

In the spoilertags below is my unranked, alphabetical list of favorites that would belong in a poll like this according to me

Spoiler: click to toggle
Here it is: http://www.imdb.com/list/ls034898972/

Next time please only post the IMDb-urls. That saves me some editing in Excel before I can paste it into IMDb-list-helper.
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joachimt
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I updated the OP with the 8 lists posted so far. Please check if you're listed correctly.
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mathiasa
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ah, lol,i pasted the wrong URL, here is my actual ranked list: https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/favourite+experimentalslashavant-garde/mathiasa/
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themagician
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Unranked: http://www.imdb.com/list/ls034824762/

I'll add more films later. Some films may be more arthouse but oh well. I picked based on what the film felt like so at least they have the spirit of avant-garde/experimental film.
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allisoncm
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themagician
Apr 4 2016, 06:17:34 PM
Unranked: http://www.imdb.com/list/ls034824762/

I'll add more films later. Some films may be more arthouse but oh well. I picked based on what the film felt like so at least they have the spirit of avant-garde/experimental film.
Thanks for including Bruce Conner films in your list. None of his films showed up when I looked under the avant-garde keyword on IMDB.
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joachimt
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allisoncm
Apr 4 2016, 06:22:24 PM
themagician
Apr 4 2016, 06:17:34 PM
Unranked: http://www.imdb.com/list/ls034824762/

I'll add more films later. Some films may be more arthouse but oh well. I picked based on what the film felt like so at least they have the spirit of avant-garde/experimental film.
Thanks for including Bruce Conner films in your list. None of his films showed up when I looked under the avant-garde keyword on IMDB.
Is it a good idea to make an unranked iCM-list of all movies voted for and keep updating it during the voting period? That way people could go through their checks and decide what to include as well.
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mathiasa
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joachimt: very good idea.
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beavis
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joachimt
Apr 4 2016, 06:03:02 PM
Here it is: http://www.imdb.com/list/ls034898972/

Next time please only post the IMDb-urls. That saves me some editing in Excel before I can paste it into IMDb-list-helper.
thanks!

and sorry about the extra work
wanted to show the titels to readers here too, but I understand the problem...
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Torgo
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joachimt
Apr 4 2016, 06:25:39 PM
allisoncm
Apr 4 2016, 06:22:24 PM
themagician
Apr 4 2016, 06:17:34 PM
Unranked: http://www.imdb.com/list/ls034824762/

I'll add more films later. Some films may be more arthouse but oh well. I picked based on what the film felt like so at least they have the spirit of avant-garde/experimental film.
Thanks for including Bruce Conner films in your list. None of his films showed up when I looked under the avant-garde keyword on IMDB.
Is it a good idea to make an unranked iCM-list of all movies voted for and keep updating it during the voting period? That way people could go through their checks and decide what to include as well.
If we do this, I also consider making a list. I would just additionally go through the Japanese films I've seen and probably have covered everything experimental by that.
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joachimt
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Alright. I won't do it continuously, but a few times, because it's a bit of work. Let's say every weekend. Remind me this Sunday if I forget about it.
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perceval
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funkybusiness
 
Charlemagne Palestine made movies? dang.
I have seen three and they are all utterly weird but of course great.

insomnius
 
I think you've got the wrong "Misery Loves Company" in there.
Thanks, this happens every time when I add this film on a list...
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